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Author Topic: The next sexual orientation...?
Dzuunmod
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Some people, from all points on the political spectrum are calling zoophilia the next sexual orientation.

As a note here, most people in the know on the subject make a distinction between zoophilia (situations where a human feels some affection or love for an animal) and bestiality (which is purely sexual for the human).

Josey Vogels has a column on the subject here. Canadian commentator Mark Steyn also writes about it here.

In the first column, Josey Vogels talks to a doctor who's done research on the subject. She finds that according to it, most people who have sex with animals do it for reasons that we might not expect. 74 per cent of respondents, for instance, do it because they want to express love or affection for the animal. 60 per cent, meanwhile, claimed that "the animal wants it".

The doctor who did the research says she started out seeing it zoophilia as a condition that needs to be cured, but after her work, she says she now sees it more as a sexual orientation.

In the second piece, Mark Steyn asks the question, 'Now that gay rights are increasingly accepted by the majority of society, what's next?' He argues that animal rights groups are likely in favour of the mainstreaming of zoophilia because it means that animals, more and more, will begin to be seen as deserving of rights, the same rights as you and I.

So, is this the next sexual orientation?

No, say I. Since the animals can't clearly consent to anything, any sex with them would have to be rape.


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BruinDan
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quote:
Originally posted by Dzuunmod:
No, say I. Since the animals can't clearly consent to anything, any sex with them would have to be rape.

And that is exactly why nearly every state in the US and many Western countries have laws that establish bestiality as a practice which is tantamount to animal cruelty. It is definitely a grey area, and I never had to work a case like that; but I think there is a definite line between being sexual with human beings and with animals.

And I tend to disagree that animal rights groups would want to legalize zoophilia, because I can see how that would lead to an increase in harm to animals in the long run. For every person who wants to engage in sexual practices with an animal as an expression of affection, there are a few unstable individuals who derive pleasure from hurting animals...and that includes sexually. Mainstreaming zoophilia would give these people the opportunity to claim, "The animal wanted it," or "I was just expressing my affection," which would protect them from liability. In my opinion, this wouldn't be a good cause for animal rights groups to champion simply for that fact alone. So I would tend to think that we're still a ways off from bringing zoophilia into the mainstream.

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Rizzo
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I'd have to agree. Although I know it is possible to feel love for an animal, I believe using them for sexual purposes is taking advantage of our human "superiority". Although the animal may appear to enjoy the act, I'm pretty sure it's something the animal wouldn't have thought up on its own. Without the ability to use language, I think such acts must be constituted as rape. Yet strangely, I don't really feel disgusted when I hear about zoophilia/bestiality...
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Phizzin
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That is utterly disgusting. I'm sorry, but it is. Having a sexual relationship with an animal is not right for the animal's sake. Animals can't decide whether they want it or not. And like the aforementioned, I believe it's a thing called rape...

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Milke
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I love my kitties dearly, but I'd never do anything sexual to them. I know they love me too, because they're both very affectionate (they'll nuzzle me, greet me with little whirring noises when I come home, and sit with me), and one's even protective (he sits above my head when I sleep, checks on me in the shower, and freaks out if a door slams shut on a room I'm in and he's not), but I'd never interpret any of that as a desire to have a sexual relationship with me. It's sort of like those games where you determine ahead of time how you're going to find you answer, and then make sure it turns out that way, like that 'he loves me, loves me not' bit with daisies. Until animals can talk to us, in our own language, or we in theirs, and have total proof that both parties understand completely what's being communicated, there's no way an animal can consent. And unconsesual sex just isn't ethical. Still, the National Post's tone is so arch and condescending that I almost want to disagree with them.
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morganlh85
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I really don't think this can be considered a sexual orienation, because animals don't have "humanphilia"...animals can't feel the same love for the human, so it's really not a sexuality. Homosexuality on the other hand, deals with a mutual love and attraction, so zoophilia doesn't really fit the category.
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Rizzo
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As I said before, I disagree with bestiality and zoophilia, but perhaps it could be regarded as a sexual orientation? I'm not sure that having a sexual orientation has anything to do with mutual interest. I could be straight, and yet there may be nobody interested in having sex with me. Similarly, on the boards I have seen Pedophilia described as a sexual orientation, even though most children are not interested in sex with adults. Could it not be possible that some people are born with a sexual attraction to animals? Just a thought-- I myself don't think it's likely, but then I don't really buy into the "born with it" idea anyway...
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John Doe
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"most" is not a criteria for sexual orientation. After all most men are not attracted to men, yet homosexuality is a sexual orientation. Sexual orientation has to do with the person who has it, not the target of the orientation. Thus a pedophile can be oriented towards children even if children are not oriented towards him (also note, that it doesn't matter if most children don't want sex with adults, there are some who would like the oppurtunity, however in this society it is not wise for either the child or the adult to act on it). Now Zoophilia seems weird to me, and I'm not into it. However, some animals are pretty good at expressing their feelings, most noticiably dogs. I'm pretty sure I can tell the difference between a happy dog with a wagging tail, and an angry dog with its fangs showing.
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perish
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pardon me while i vomit. *uiiiighhhhhaaa*

there. zoophilia...aka the "let's see what kind of new incredibly destructive pathogens we can introduce into the human species" game.


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Lynne
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First of all, as I learned (and argued over) in an asexuality thread a few months ago, orientation only technically refers to gender attraction. I think that it's possible for somebody to have an involuntary attraction to animals, though.

And now, time to play devil's advocate.

For those of you saying that animals can't consent to any sexual act, well... animals can't consent to anything we do to them. They don't consent to being put on leashes, or taught tricks, or any other number of things, and yet the majority of people don't see any ethical problem with these things. So why are sexual activities different? Some do hurt the animal and/or expose it to disease, but other practices don't. So why are those physically harmless activites any worse than, say, teaching a dog to roll over?

Just something to think about. I'm not advocating that you go out and have sex with your pet. I'm just interested in the justification for the "all non-consentual sex with an animal is unethical" position in light of what I pointed out.

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[This message has been edited by Lynne (edited 09-14-2001).]


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towel42
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quote:
Originally posted by Lynne:
First of all, as I learned (and argued over) in an asexuality thread a few months ago, orientation only technically refers to gender attraction. I think that it's possible for somebody to have an involuntary attraction to animals, though.

And now, time to play devil's advocate.

For those of you saying that animals can't consent to any sexual act, well... animals can't consent to anything we do to them. They don't consent to being put on leashes, or taught tricks, or any other number of things, and yet the majority of people don't see any ethical problem with these things. So why are sexual activities different? Some do hurt the animal and/or expose it to disease, but other practices don't. So why are those physically harmless activites any worse than, say, teaching a dog to roll over?

Just something to think about. I'm not advocating that you go out and have sex with your pet. I'm just interested in the justification for the "all non-consentual sex with an animal is unethical" position in light of what I pointed out.



You can't really argue with that; its a good point. But let's face it, in our culture sexuality is still a taboo, especially when it comes to things of this nature. Therefore, the vast majority of people wouldn't want to see others or themselves cross that boundry when it comes to animals. Most people view the situation like this: sexuality and actual physical harm are both forms of abuse when they aren't consensual. However, anything else you may do with your pet is fine and good because we're simply taking care of the creature.

Whether that is a morally correct status to be taking on, I can't say. *shrugs* Bear in mind I'm just now speaking for what I'm willing to bet is a large part of the population. I don't know if what I stated is right...like someone said, its such a grey area its hard to establish a firm opinion.

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Lee
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What will they think of next? When things get past a certain point all I can do is laugh and shake my head. Here we've got all these psychologists coming up with crazy ideas seemingly because they are in competition with one another. Then there are those who somehow feel that they have some sort of ethical or moral insight that the rest of us lack. Here at ASU we've got a few of these psychobabble types trying to tell us that we shouldn't hate the guerillas that attacked us last week. Their reasoning? That to do so would make us just like them. I'm sorry, but the fact that you claim to be student of how the human mind works doesn't give you the moral authority to define what kinds of thoughts and emotions are right and wrong. I'll hate whomever I like and the fact that I do doesn't make me anything. In truth I don't hate them, its hard to hate someone who hasn't got long to live. I reserve my hate for those people who are going to be hanging around and causing grief, like psychobabble psychologists.

They wouldn't bother me so much if it weren't for the touchy-feely almost condescending attitude they have. Imagine Stuart from Saturday Night Live and you've got some idea what I'm talking about.


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momma cat
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In regards to "an animal wouldn't have come up with animal/human sex on it's own" you must be one of those blessed people who haven't been humped by a dog.
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