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Author Topic: I don't need a gender!
Ste-Funnie
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"You have boobs!" "Do you have a penis?" "She's not talking about your boobs. She just said that you have them!" The hell? That idiot asks me personal questions and don't get in trouble. Luckily she moved. But what did she want from me? I used to feel like I might be transgender but no one would respect that. So then I decide that if I can't be a guy, I don't wanna be a girl either. I used to not want any sexual organ. Not a penis or a vagina. Nothing! Just an anus and a urethral gland. Nothing reproductive. If I wanna have kids, I could adopt. Why can't we just be asexual reproductive? Sometimes things I want in the past, I dont want anymore but still think I should've got it in the first place! The motto is "SOMETIMES you can't ALWAYS get what you want in life". Who said "You can NEVER get what you want"?

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Saffron Raymie
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Hallo Ste-Funnie

I'm sorry that person was being very personal about your body; nobody has that right.

I don't need a gender either. I have a vulva and a vagina; but no gender. I don't act like a 'girl' or a 'guy'.

Sex and gender are not the same thing. Sex means whether we have a vulva and a vagina or a penis, and gender is whether we act like a 'guy' or a 'girl'. Gender is what we call the ideas people have about how people with a vulva should act, or how people with a penis should act; but these are stereotypes - ideas, opinions, NOT actual facts about how someone with certain reproductive body parts should act.

Sometimes a person can act like a 'guy' like fixing cars when they actually have a vulva and a vagina, sometimes a person can act like a 'girl' like painting their nails when they actually have a penis.

Take a peek at this: http://www.scarleteen.com/article/body/genderpalooza_a_sex_gender_primer

[ 01-03-2011, 06:46 PM: Message edited by: RaeRay2112 ]

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~ Saffy
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To my Abuser: I'm seeing stars. I bet you can't do that.

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Ste-Funnie
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What is a vulva?

Also, today I'm pretty happy with my organs. I don't really care about my boobs, but you cant have no organs. Otherwise I couldn't get excited when I sexually fantasize women. Cuz we all like the way it feels to get turned on. I wouldn't want a penis whatsoever. That would be trans. Now I know the diff. Back then, I thought that I needed to be a guy b/c lezz life is hard and I thought it would be easier. Plus, I thought it was fun, but my friend who is trans (innie to outie) has a hard time. Also, b/c I'm tired of having my period. At least I'm on seasonique. If I could literally be male just for a while than change back, I would try that and see what it's like. I used to suspect that I was born male, and my mom wasn't happy that she got a boy, so she changed my sex.

I wanna watch a video of a real sex change op. Do you know any sites that have it?

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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CoatRack
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Wow, I'm having a kind of hard time with some of the things you said there. I feel like some of them were kind of insensitive and some of them were just rude.

First off, "trans" or "transgender" is an umbrella term - that means that it covers a TON of stuff, from people who have sexual reassignment surgery* to people like me, who have set up life in the middle ground of gender, to a thousand different variants. "trans" does not just mean people who have surgery and use hormones to change their sexual characteristics.

Using phrases like "innie" and "outie" isn't really cool with a lot of trans people - it's reducing people to their genitals. I am SO much more than just a set of body parts! If you want to talk about somebody who transitioned from male to female you can use phrases like "MTF" or "FTM" which stand for "Male to Female" or "Female to Male." Same thing with the video of a sex change operation - that's reducing people to their genitals. Trans people, ALL people, are SO much more than that!

Lastly, Gender Identity and Sexual Orientation really don't have a ton to do with one another. Gender Identity is who you are, Sexual Orientation is who you love.

*what you called a "sex change;" the proper term is sexual reassignment surgery, or SRS.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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CoatRack
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And a vulva is the proper name for external female genitalia - what most folks call the vagina is really the vulva. The vagina is inside, the vulva is outside.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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Ste-Funnie
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I'm sorry if I offended you. I looked at your thingy and on your gender identity it said queer. Just being curious, what is your sex/gender? If the question makes you uncomfortable you dont have to answer.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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CoatRack
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My gender is queer. My sex is unimportant.

Seriously, it does not matter. What is between my legs is immaterial to this conversation. It is immaterial to pretty much any conversation unless I am talking with somebody about a sexual relationship.

That is what I meant by categorizing/reducing people to their genitals.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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Saffron Raymie
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Ste-Funnie, I'm not saying you've done anything wrong here, but have you ever heard the saying 'the grass is always greener on the other side'?

I think you said in another post that you think you 'always want what you can't have'. Often, when someone approaches a problem in their life; they think how they could have avoided it if things were different. That maybe isn't the best way to tackle a problem.

Lots of people have problems no matter what their sexual orientation or gender identity or whatever their body's reproductive system is like. Life is hard for lots and lots of people, not just people with a vulva (outside parts of female gentials). People who don't have periods may also have different problems that are just as bad or worse than ones that are about menstruation.

My gender is unimportant; I'm just me.

I celebrate my body and its sex with pride, but that doesn't mean I don't respect people who's systems are different to mine; there's no better or worse - we all have body problems no matter what type it is, or how it looks.

Despite my appreciation, my system doesn't define me, no matter how many people make a 'big deal' out my sex by saying it must define my heart, my mind, my soul, brain and spirit. It just doesn't. We're all so very different.

I know it doesn't define me when other people say things that are rude about it - like words for my breasts that offend me. It doesn't matter what people say - I'm proud of my body for its reproductive system, all stystems are special; no matter which one we've got - it's our personal reproductive system, mine is very special to me because its part of my body, and because of my sexual orientation - I love people with all different reproductive systems - but I have a special place in my heart for people with ones like mine, because it reminds me of my own special body. [Smile]

But it doesn't control my life - there's lots of different ways of living life because of our minds, our hearts, our souls, our brains...not our reproductive systems.

A great thing you can do for yourself is to try your best not to listen to people being rude about your sexual orientation, or reproductive system, or how you look, because often, these rude things are homophobia, sexism and lookism; and they are unfair and harmful views. Sometimes, a LOT of us listen to them and become upset and offended, to which we have every right - those people should NOT be saying what they are. It's not really our fault for listening, but if we can try not to and get away from these people (luckily that person moved away for you) for our own protection, we can become happier without them, and realise what they were saying was harmful.

You CAN get what you want in life. YOU are in control of YOUR own life, not other people. They have their own lives to lead. Ste-Funnie's life is for Ste-Funnie alone, and if people don't respect and accept Ste-Funnie, that is THEIR problem, not Ste-Funnie's! Good luck in being free to be yourself, relaxed and in control of your own life and who YOU are, not what other people decide for you [Smile]

[ 01-04-2011, 11:05 AM: Message edited by: RaeRay2112 ]

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~ Saffy
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To my Abuser: I'm seeing stars. I bet you can't do that.

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Ste-Funnie
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CoatRack: Not to be rude but queer isn't a gender, its an orientation. I'm just saying. You dont have to tell me your sex or whatnot. Your call. I just wanted to know if I should call you he or she anytime I mention you.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Bonnie.N.Clyde
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Hi Ste-Funnie! I think a person's gender is up for their own interpretation, which is why CoatRack's queer gender identification should be honored. They can only know how they identify. Queer can certainly be a gender identification. As for pronouns, why not ask CoatRack how they would like to be identified, or whether they would like a gender pronoun at all (?). Many folks use pronouns that exist outside of the restrictions of "he" or "she". [Smile]

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Heather
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Ste-funnie: it's really not alright here for people to tell others how to identify, okay? I'd not be down with anyone doing that to you here (which I doubt you'd appreciate yourself), and I'm equally not okay with you doing it to anyone else.

As well, just know that queer is a term which has been in use for some time by people to describe either or both gender identity and sexual orientation. CoatRack is hardly the first person to identify hir gender as queer, not by a long shot. But even if ze was, I'd hope anyone here would still be respectful of that and identify CoatRack as CoatRack asked to be identified.

We can also ask what language someone wants to be identified by without having to ask what their sex is (which sometimes has nothing to do with how someone wants to be identified). All we need to do is ask something like "If I'm talking about you and using pronouns, what pronoun would you like me to use?" Or, you can do what I did in the paragraph before last and use gender-neutral pronouns until you know someone's personal preferences.

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Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen
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Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead

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Ste-Funnie
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This is getting ridiculous! I didn't know queer is a gender too! I misunderstood! You and coatrack aren't the only people making me the bad guy. Everyone does that except my health class mates. Guilty me! Guilty me! OMG! When I dated that guy I told you about, my "friend" did the same thing I did to C.R. but way worse. She said, "If anyone ever asks what your sexuality is, say that you're bisexual. You are def bisexual." Of course, she shouldn't've said that. If she said it on here, she'd be in big trouble. I would never say that to C.R. or anyone. That's good credit. What's worse is she ordered me about my orientation, which ticked me off. That chick know nothing about the gay life or anything. I wish she'd say it on here so she can get in trouble, and thats how flipped I am. If she said that to me right now I could jus' say what you said and stand up for my self and tell her to go identify her own sexuality!

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Ste-Funnie
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Oh and I'm sorry if I offended you C.R. I just want you to know that sometime I say the wrong things cuz I have autism. I could be a little curious. I just wanted to know what pronouns you would like to be called.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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CoatRack
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I have been working with children, youth, and adults with ASDs and other pervasive developmental delays for over 11 years at this point. I get autism. I'm sorry if it has made communication more difficult for you.

However, my points remain. Curiosity is not a problem. Outright being rude is a problem. Because this is the internet it's easier to just say stuff sometimes that you normally wouldn't say in person, but because it IS the internet you also have the time to sit there, re-read what you write, and look over the guidelines to make sure that what you are saying is within the terms of service agreement that you are asked to read and agree to when you sign up.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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Heather
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Ste-funnie: it's clear you didn't know. But here's the thing: you spoke like you did, and in fact, like you knew better than someone saying that was how they identified.

No one is making you the bad guy here. We're simply asking that you try and leave more room for other people when you're here, and try not to speak over other people's knowledge or experience, or to tell other folks how it is (similar to how you did in that one thread when you told bisexual people how to be bisexual, basically, based on what you think).

So, just leave room for other folks, okay? And maybe leave a lot more room for the possibility that there's probably plenty you don't know (since there's plenty we all don't know) or which is outside your own experience. I think it's maybe also a good idea to check in with yourself when you come to post in spaces like this to be sure that you really want a discussion and want something where other people will need to be thought of, rather than just to vent or talk about yourself. Like I've told you before, in those cases, the best bet is to write in something like a journal rather than a shared community space. Thanks.

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Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen
About Me • Get our book!
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead

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Ste-Funnie
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I getcha. But y'all should give me credit b/c at least I didn't say the exact words of the interpretation. "You have to be this". Like that friend I told you about. I don't EVER order people about identity. Not jus' orientation/gender but like race, religion, mental disorders, etc.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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CoatRack
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One of the hardest Hardest HARDEST lessons I had to learn was how to accept that I was wrong about something without blaming somebody else, without thinking "at least I'm better than that person," and without getting mad that I was wrong.

You said something that was wrong. You were called out. There's nothing WRONG with that. You didn't know. Sometimes we don't know things. Lots of times we don't know things. It's OK to not know things. Where it gets squicky is when you start saying "Yeah, but...!"

If you have *questions* about being called out for something then, by all means, ask about why something you said was offensive. But when you've been called out on something? Just accept that you were wrong, apologize if you like, and agree to stop using the offensive terminology.

I like to use the "name it, claim it, stop it" technique, which is followed up with the "listen, learn, accept" response.

Person A says something offensive.

Person B says "Hey, you just said ___, which I find offensive because of ___, can you please not use that word in the future?"

Person A listens to what they have to say, learns why that person finds what they said offensive, and accepts that they unintentionally hurt somebody.

And then they go back to their conversation. It's over. It's done. No harm, no foul.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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Ste-Funnie
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I didn't say that I wasn't wrong. Of course I accept it. Just b/c I'm wrong, it doesn't mean its so bad that I dont deserve positivity. What I said was true about that friend. (I'll call her Curly) Curly really did say something worse and I'm glad I didn't say that otherwise I'd be in bigger trouble. In other words, I didn't say the wort thing in the world. Curly said that if anyone asks my orientation that I have to say that I'm bi. She even said that I am bi and that's all there is to it. Wouldn't you call that worse? It took me till 8th grade to learn to accept that I'm wrong. I only don't accept it if I regret doing it. There are people who have to accept that there wrong for doing something to me too. Everyone has to.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Onionpie
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Hi Ste-funnie. I understand that you're upset, but this really wasn't about whether what you said was "as bad" as what your friend did or not. Absolutely, your friend "Curly" was incredibly offensive and wrong in trying to tell you what you should identify as. However, this was simply about the fact that people found what YOU said to be offensive, and you needed to recognize and respect that.

This conversation has really gone off track from the original post. Can I request that we all try to accept that this doesn't seem to have anywhere else to go, and get back onto the topic at hand? If anyone wants to discuss the topic further or is confused about something, you could contact us via email, but this isn't really the place to be having this discussion.

Thanks guys [Smile]

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CoatRack
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Sorry for derailing the conversation.

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Hey folks, my name is Andrew and I was a mod here for awhile a couple years ago. I'll be here for a couple weeks while Heather is out and the site is even more short-staffed than usual

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Ste-Funnie
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I don't know what that means but there's no need for sorry. I'm the one who's sorry which I said 30xs lol.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Ste-Funnie
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Also when you yelled at me for the way I talked to C.R., Heather, it actually taught me something else. What you said to me when you confronted me, I wish I thought to say that to Curly when she said what I said to C.R. Now I know what to say for next time. I know a lot of people are going to get on my case about my sexuality. I'm going to get a lot of opportunities to stand up for my sexuality and myself. Maybe not from Curly, maybe not on this sight, but I don't know the future.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Heather
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I didn't yell at anyone. I made some request and set some boundaries.

Just so you know in terms of cues and reading things online, we do have a way of knowing when someone is yelling, because the format for that is all caps.

Yelling is like -- now I'm about to do it, but only to give you an example of what it looks like -- THIS! YELLING IS ALL CAPS LIKE THIS!

[Smile]

[ 01-06-2011, 06:58 PM: Message edited by: Heather ]

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Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen
About Me • Get our book!
Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead

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Ste-Funnie
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I can see that but I didn't literally mean 'yelling'. I meant confronting, or criticizing etc.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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Stephanie_1
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There's a huge difference in terms though. (Teacher moment... sorry) you can confront someone, and definitely criticize someone without every yelling. Yelling is literally a raising of tone and volume in voice (or online using caps to signify that same thing). I confront students in my classroom, parents when there's a problem, family and friends on issues when I feel they've overstepped boundaries without ever yelling.

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"Sometimes the majority only means that all the fools are on the same side" ~Anon

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Ste-Funnie
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Oh and about what CR said about me having to accept that I'm wrong, well, when I confronted Curly, I couldn't convince her to accept that she was wrong to say what I said to CR. Back then I bit at persuading. She totally should've tolerated the fact that what she said was wrong, therefore I did the same for her. When I got upset about what Curly said, I cursed at her and she got mad, so late I apologized and knew I was wrong to drop curse bombs on her and I accepted it. So I don't see why she didn't do the same thing for what she did.

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~Stephanie Gabriella Murray
I'm very gay for being a lesbian, and not gay to be what I'm not

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