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» Scarleteen Boards: 2000 - 2014 (Archive) » SCARLETEEN CENTRAL » Support Groups » Feeling like the world would be a better place if I wasn't alive. (Page 2)

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Author Topic: Feeling like the world would be a better place if I wasn't alive.
Ecofem
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Hi Jill, I'm happy to hear about all the good news and fun you've been having with your new beau. [Smile] I'm sorry you had a rough evening but that will happen even when things are mostly good; it sounds like you found a good way to cope and are ready for a fresh start in the morning!
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keepinitgreen
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Recently my mom has been pointing out exactly how I'm ruining her life. And how she might lose her job and her boyfriend because of me. A couple weeks ago my dad was telling my sister about when my mom was pregnant with her and about her nursery and stuff. I asked about my moms pregnancy with me and he said they were seriously considering abortion. By the time they were about to make a decision it was too late. Lately I've been feeling like things would be better for everyone in my life, if I wasn't there. I took a lot of pills and thought I was going to die. I was throwing up for 3 days and told my mom I had the stomach flu. But I've realized now that life is worth living. Every moment, even the bad ones. Live for yourself if you feel like you don't have anyone and in time you will see how much people do care about you. [Smile]
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Jill2000Plus
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Thankyou Keepinitgreen, I'm sorry you were feeling sad and I'm sure the world wouldn't be a better place without you in it, I do think parents should be honest about things like considering abortion when they were pregnant with you, but they shouldn't use it as a way of putting the born, rights having, current you down, you do matter, very much.

I had a rather tearful day yesterday as I could see how my boyfriend is really worried about getting thrush from me and I don't want to give him an itchy red dischargey penis, I'm sure we'll work it out though, he seems fine with wearing latex gloves and condoms, I'm seeing him tomorrow and I'm really excited, we did a lot of dry humping last time and I was so happy to see how much he trusts me, he was just letting himself relax and enjoy it, though I think he managed to crush his thingamajig (couldn't resist but I do mean penis) while he was changing positions so that put him off a bit, and we're still talking loads, I love him so much and he makes me feel really happy [Smile] [Smile] I'm going to try and make sure I keep up with my hobbies and interests and my other friends and keep enjoying masturbation and just remember that I can individually be happy and he makes my life better as opposed to completing me.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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I've been feeling a bit upset because I'm not seeing my partner for a week or two, and last time we met up I wanted to do something that he didn't and we didn't do it because he didn't seem enthusiastic but I may have brought it up a few too many times, I was just trying to get an idea of how he felt about it and he said he didn't feel pressured when I asked him about it but I've just been worrying because consent is very important to me and I never ever want to hurt him and sometimes I worry that by talking about how horny/aroused I feel with him I'm going to make him feel pressured to do things he doesn't want to do, if he seems apprehensive or doesn't consent or otherwise isn't into something we won't do it but I just keep on worrying that I'm evil and abusive and destined to screw up this relationship and hurt him in the process even though I know I love him and I care about him and I know to be gentle and to communicate about my feelings, I worry sometimes he might not believe that I really do love it when we just cuddle and kiss, that I'm not just waiting to get to "the really good stuff" because all this tenderness is the really good stuff, anyway I'm missing him loads, though I do have other stuff I want to do, so I guess this is a good opportunity to do it.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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marigold
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I've read your letter in the other thread ("Should I send this to him?"), and you're soooooooooooo NOT "evil and abusive and destined to screw up this relationship and hurt him in the process". These are the same awful toughts as from the beginning of this board, and you shouldn't believe them.

Which of course you already know with the not-worrying part of your brain, so I'm not writing here to be surprising, just to support you a bit, as far as it's possible via a message board.

I'd like to give you a virtual hug, but maybe those aren't nice to receive from strangers from the other end of the world.

If you're really a bit pressuring, altrough I don't know if any of this is true or just a worry, then there might be room to refine a bit the way you threat these issues, and I hope some more experienced people from the forum can help you in this... but you have communication and honesty and goodness and a whole lot of other wonderful things in this relationship and in general, so I think the details can be made better, but you shouldn't worry about the whole.

you're great and it has been inspiring to read this thread from the beginning to the last posts.

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{*)>>>{

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Jill2000Plus
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If you still want to give me that virtual hug then it's very much appreciated.

I've thought some more about it and I talked to my mentor and support worker about it and I think it will be ok, he loves me and I love him and I'm just going to keep on remembering that, and I've resolved that I'm not going to apologise when I make utterly harmless jokes or puns or tell him there's something I'd like to try if he wants to or when I say I love him many times, I always apologise and feel self concious about expressing my feelings and wants and I want to stop doing that because it hurts me and it might end up hurting him if he gets the idea that it's not ok for him to express his feelings and wants.

I'm also starting to realise that even if I'm not the most self sufficient of individuals (I'm rubbish at doing chores), I do bring something of great value to the world by being honest about my feelings and trying to take care of and support those around me, I'd never realised just how valuable that kind of stuff is until just now, I'm always putting myself down for not contributing enough to society but I am helping to make a better world, even if I'm not so good at cleaning up after myself sometimes (not that I'm saying that isn't important).

[ 02-22-2010, 04:55 PM: Message edited by: Jill2000Plus ]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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marigold
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I'm glad you're feeling better. [Smile] Go Jill, go! [if I understand correctly how you use expressions like this.]

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Jill2000Plus
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You're using that expression just fine [Smile] Personally I would probably have been a bit goofy about it and said "go team Jill!" but it's all good [Wink]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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marigold
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As for the team, if I were more, than two thousand, I wouldn't hesitate to call myself a team, Jill2000plus. [Wink]


[yes, I know.]

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Jill2000Plus
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Actually, has anyone figured out what my username is a reference to (hint: my real name isn't Jill)?

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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I just wanted to say things are really great at the moment, I was very worried about putting pressure on my boyfriend and he got stressed out because he was in a physically vulnerable position at one point where we didn't do anything but we were talking about it and he wasn't ready so we stopped and we talked and since then everything's been really good, I told him if we are going to be sexual together which we don't have to be I need him to accept me touching myself in front of him eventually (which wasn't the stressy thing either) and I'd feel like something was missing if he wasn't ok with it in time because I want to be able to do what feels good when we're having sex and I told him how it would make it much easier to orgasm during intercourse, I told him that I love the stuff we do together I just want to have as full a sensory experience as I can, and he listened, and he gets it.

I told him I love him and I said loads of stuff about how we don't have to do physical stuff at all and that we can always do other things together and because he said he felt like he was being selfish when he didn't want to do sexual things I wanted to do I went through a bunch of stuff I thought might make him think that (feeling like he had to prove his love through sex, feeling like he owes me if I pay for stuff on our dates, that sort of thing) and told him that it doesn't make him selfish at all and that I know he'd never think that way about me so I wanted him to show himself that same kindness and love, I emphasised that his body is his and I told him what the risks are to the best of my knowledge for him getting thrush from me (I haven't been dishonest with him but there is a lot of conflicting information even from what I'd consider to be trustworthy sources, I've told him the information I've gotten from different places including when two sources have said different things) and just generally I'm doing my best.

He told me about how he's feeling down at the moment and he's still recovering from the heavy workload of college a year ago and a bunch of other stuff which I listened to, we discussed his porn use (which I don't have an issue with, I just wanted to reassure him that he doesn't have to hide it) and explained some stuff about condoms that he didn't know that was making him worried and told him I could give him some if he wants to see what they're like and we could look at them together and I'd be happy to show him how to put one on when he feels ready for that (I will get us to a sexual health something or another together so he can be shown on something that's not his penis) and our last date went really well, I didn't make him feel pressured (which has never been my intention), we just relaxed and did what felt right at the time and I knew that I would have liked it if we'd just sat and talked because I like just being with him, which I think is what's really important.

And I told him how beautiful I think he is, and he told me all sorts of nice stuff to that effect too, we both completely accept each other's physical bodies which I think is really good, he tells me I'm lovely the way I am and I say the same thing.

Just generally I'm feeling more confident lately, I'm not saying I would hurt him or pressure him if I felt bad about myself or that that would make that ok or understandable, I just mean that I've made some important realisations, the biggie being that just because I'm always learning doesn't mean I can't use logic or science (which I never really believed but which was one of those things that my head kept on throwing at me), that and I'm going to try and improve my physical health for a variety of reasons (among them: curing the thrush, not getting the type II diabetes that runs in my family, having more energy/strength/stamina, not developing joint problems, living longer which also means hopefully not dying much sooner than my partner and leaving them without me, avoiding the horrors of constipation) so I'm feeling good about that too. [Smile]

Edit: I'm also going to try and get him to do more research on his own and with me about these kinds of things because I don't want to be where he gets all his information from, I'd rather encourage him to look things up for himself so he has more autonomy.

[ 03-12-2010, 12:16 PM: Message edited by: Jill2000Plus ]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Cian
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Hi Jill!
Just wanted to say that I'm really happy to hear you're doing so good and things are working out smoothly. It's also very inspiring for me to see people make it through tough times-- it makes me feel more motivated to try and undo all the knots in my life so I, too, will reach a point in life where I feel good and things are all right and well. (Or at least manageable, haha!)

All I can tell you is: Awesome, Jill!

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Jill2000Plus
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Thanks Cian, I appreciate the encouragement and I hope you can work out the stuff that's been upsetting you. [Smile]

I talked to him on the phone today and again, it was good, I told him how how happy I am that our last date went so well and that I want that to always be how things are, no pressure, just enjoying being together and going at a pace that's comfortable for both of us, that's what I've always wanted from this relationship and I can be very foolish sometimes worrying about whether other people I know would think there's something wrong/not normal/uncool about the way we act when we're together, I'm very self-concious about being an aspie in a relationship and I've realised that I've got to ditch that because it's just going to hurt both of us, I just want to enjoy being in love and being kind to each other and being together, and the awesomeness of the sex, which has been lovely [Smile] [Big Grin] [Big Grin] [Smile]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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Also... I found my condom carry case! It went missing for a week and I had just been hoping somebody too embarrassed or poor to buy condoms had found it but when my stuff came out of the washing machine there it was! I've thrown away the two condoms that were in it but I've got plenty more and I've got my pocket case back now so w00t! I also went to a gig this week which was amazing, it was this cinematic fluid Ennio Morricone-esque glo/chillwave band called Memory Tapes and I was really into the music and there were staff from one of the local indie record stores there so we said hi, I really love this band, the song "Stop Talking" has one of the sexiest electronic riffs/beats that I've ever heard in my whole life, I didn't even care that the band was on for only 30 minutes, and the support band was good too, they were called Visions of Trees.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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Everything's a bit overwhelming at the moment because my boyfriend has lied to me about some stuff, he's now told me the truth and said he's gotten into the habit of lying all the time even though he doesn't want to, I told him that it's very important to me that he's honest with me, he also told me that someone tried to rape him once (nothing actually happened, he managed to escape and went to the police station) and I'm thinking how best to support him because I don't know if he might still be traumatised by it, he acknowledges that he needs to get some kind of help with all his issues and I'm just wondering if there's any way I can get him long term counselling (he's 20 so I'm not sure if it's covered by the NHS), his dad's unemployed and he doesn't have a job (he's trying to get one), I'm really concerned about him because he always tries to deal with things on his own and he needs help and I don't think he really has much of a financial safety net, my brain's all confuzzled right now.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Heather
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Legal adults can get counseling through the NHS just like younger people can, and by all means, rape or attempted rape tends to be traumatic for everyone.

But *you* can't get him counseling or help: that's something he will need to get himself, and it's up to him.

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Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen
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Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead

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Ecofem
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Hey Jill, I saw you were around tonight and wanted to check in and see how you're doing. I'll be at work tomorrow so won't be able to respond till later, but I'd love to hear what you're up to, if you'd like to share. I can imagine you're on break from uni right now? [Smile]
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Jill2000Plus
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Well, I no longer have a yeast infection [Big Grin] [Smile] [Cool] [Smile] [Big Grin] ! My boyfriend is also very happy about this. I'm actually not at uni, I'm still catching up on GCSEs I missed due to being home educated and while I understand the material I tend to forget to revise, I'll try and do that this Thursday as I have nothing else to do. I'm also taking an figure drawing class which I'm enjoying, there's somebody nekkid every week and a variety of art supplies and everyone gets to work [Smile] . I have taken a shower and gotten dressed but I haven't cleaned my teeth, I've tried to phone my boyfriend several times and then left him a text asking if there's a good time for me to phone or if another day would be better so he doesn't feel overwhelmed, things have been going a lot better lately, I've completely stopped being pressuring now, but I did snap and swear at him once the last time he was here and I've been beating myself up about it, I apologised profusely, and I meant it, I could see that I really hurt his feelings and we took some time to discuss it and then we made up, and we ended up snuggling under the duvet in our underwear, we saw each other completely naked for the first time too and I gave him my first handjob, I wasn't sure if he sounded a bit apprehensive when we were on the phone on Sunday, but in the end we had a really good conversation so I think everything's fine. He's really busy and he might be doing some work in london so we probably won't see each other for a while, I'm going to miss him loads but I'm happy for him because he has a chance to do what he wants with his life. I also made a compilation CD yesterday and did my chores. I've been doing peer education training with my youth group to give workshops in schools about LGBTQphobic bullying and sexual health, it's not quite the kind of sex positive, yay pleasure stuff I want to do long term but it's important nonetheless, I keep meaning to fill in my volunteer form for modding here but it's taking time, I'm not very good at these sorts of things. I've been watching more animation, I saw Ponyo on a Cliff (which was beautiful, though I got a bit upset because I was thinking about all the new challenges Ponyo would face as a homosapien woman if she changed, how she'd be pressured to be pregnant and a mother) and The Princess and the Frog (which had an alligator that played the trumpet and was entertaining other than the implication that having children is the one size fits all way to express deep love for one's partner when it's a huge commitment that requires thought, the desire to be a parent and material resources and it's perfectly possible to love someone deeply without wanting to have children) at the cinema and I've also been watching Noir and Full Metal Panic! and rewatching Azumanga Daioh to cheer myself up, and I've got Angelic Layer, Bubblegum Crisis Tokyo 2040 and Full Metal Panic: Fumoffu! coming in the mail soon (some of the Angelic Layer singles arrived today!). I am now going to go to my youth group and have a good time and maybe go clubbing afterwards, I sang karaoke at the bar last time and it felt good to get up there and give it a go, it doesn't even matter if you sound good or not because it's about having fun.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Ecofem
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Hi Jill!

So happy to hear about your yeast infection going away! Good luck revising for your GCSEs -- are you taking them this summer? Your figure drawing class sounds like fun-- I plan to take one this summer. I hope you and your boyfriend can see each other soon, and I'm glad he's able to do the work he's always wanted to do in London. I'd be interested in hearing more about your per education training, and hope you finish your ST app soon. [Wink] That sounds like a pretty deep interpretation of those films (hope you can apply those analysis skills to your GCSEs!) I hope you have/had a good evening out tonight, too! [Smile]

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Jill2000Plus
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I'm actually just taking the one GCSE this year, it's the maths one, I'm enjoying the classes because maths is one of my favourite subjects but I still am looking forward to having easter break, starting tomorrow. I hope you enjoy your figure drawing class too. I also got my favourite hat back, I was in a local bar when I lost it and one of my friends handed it to me last night and said they'd somehow ended up with it when all our stuff was piled together on the floor. I had more nightmares last night: giant tentacled monsters from the depths of the ocean destroying ships I'm on, slugs in my nether regions making holes all over my body, films that turn violently nasty when I least expect it, parents not caring whether I'm ok or not while all this is happening, and then I made out with one of my friends who's not my boyfriend (again, this was in the nightmare) and that just made me feel bad because I thought it was real and I had cheated on my boyfriend (I wish I'd know it wasn't real because then I could have just enjoyed it). I have my last maths class of this term today so I'm going to go and get ready for it soon, I've almost finished Full Metal Panic! now too and Full Metal Panic: Fumoffu (which is a comedic side series) arrived in the post today, I love this show, it's got action and comedy and drama and romance and politics and giant robots and high school shenanigans, plus the animation is excellent (you could believe it was made this year from how well integrated the CGI is). The only issue I have with it is it's one of those shows where the male characters get attacked by the female characters when they're pissed off at them even when the male characters weren't attacking the female characters at the time or at all in that instance, there's some totally justified smackdowns as Kurt Weber tries to grope Melissa Mao on one occasion, for instance, but most of the time it's just amounts to "it's alright to use men/boys as punching bags because... because it is alright! I'm not applying a double standard at all!" [Roll Eyes] (note that was not an actual series quote, just my summary of the attitude expressed), there's also a bit where one of the female characters is lying on top of one of the male characters with her crotch against his (they are clothed, but that doesn't make it ok) and he tries to wriggle out of it and she keeps moving back into that position and it's treated as humourous... sexual assault really isn't funny. On another note I have made the unfortunate discovery that my Terry Pratchett books are missing which is frustrating because I'm trying to start reading again and those books would have been a great gateway drug. I think I'll read The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy again along with Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency and The Long Dark Teatime of the Soul instead. Anyways I'd better go and get ready for my maths class.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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I had intercourse for the first time on Sunday! It was really enjoyable, I didn't orgasm during, but I had a really intense one before we started and it was so nice being close to him and having him inside me, and he came, which made me happy to see him happy plus it's the first orgasm he's had from partnered sex, the condom slipped off as he was pulling out after we finished but I've taken my birth control pill without fail so I don't think it's really worth worrying about, I will explain to him about gripping it at the base as he pulls out before we do it again, the first time I tried to do it and my hand was all numb so I couldn't. Also, he said condoms felt really good on his penis, I think it's because everything glides smoothly, my point being that what some people say about how condoms supposedly make sex less pleasurable for guys isn't all men's experience, I don't know whether there are some guys who prefer it physically without, but that's definitely not all men. Anyway everything's good, I made him a card for his 21st birthday which was recent as well, he really liked it though he didn't take it home because it's on A3 and he has to take a train, at least that means I can show everyone else my handiwork.

I've still got to do more maths revision, my legs are aching for some reason so I think I'll skip my youth group today and do revision and chores instead, less energy required. I've been watching more animated films, I'm trying to watch all the ones I have that I haven't watched, I last watched The Corpse Bride which I thought was affectingly beautiful and gothic (plus that whole "die, die, we all pass away, but don't wear a frown because it's really ok" thing was really catchy), after deciding to leave Hellboy: Blood and Iron for later because for some reason I'm not that enthused about watching it, part of it is definitely the changes made to the art style, The Amazing Screw On Head really looked like Mike Mignola's artwork in motion but the Hellboy animated features? Not so much (I like the comics and enjoyed the second live action movie, haven't seen the first but I have it on DVD). I'm now watching Persepolis, which is a great film apart from the small penis jokes and possibly some sizeism against fat people. I'm watching them in order of runtime from shortest to longest, I've already watched all the shorter anime ones and have combined all the remaining films from all countries into one big runtime ordered bundle... I love animation so much [Smile] .

Finally, I bought my first vibrator and it feels really good, I've been meaning to get one for years and it's awesome.

[ 05-18-2010, 11:05 AM: Message edited by: Jill2000Plus ]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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I had a really rough night last night, I couldn't stop crying because of all the intrusive thoughts I keep having and how bad I was feeling about being alive and having a body, I felt a bit suicidal because I'm worried it will never stop, I feel so much fear and I want to shut down when I hear all the messages about how horrible my sexuality is and how I'm wrong for not wanting to be pregnant and wanting an abortion if I am, when I think back to being younger and believing on some level that my parents owned me, please will someone respond because I'm feeling really fragile now.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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treetops
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I haven't spoken to you before but your posts are always thoughtful and interesting. I'm sorry you're feeling so crappy [Frown] . I don't know what to say really, other than when I am feeling really bad and it feels like it won't end, I remember when I've felt good and had positive experiences, and try to remind myself that there is no reason why I won't feel that way again. Most bad feelings do pass, or at least fluctuate in how bad they feel; sometimes it's just a matter of taking care of yourself (with a cup of tea and cake, or a walk, or music, or just curling up in bed till it passes) until you are feeling OK again.

Also, although there are a lot of crappy messages around, and the society we live in does promote a lot of BS, there are always people who don't believe in it and who work to dispel the rubbish and I take comfort from that. (Scarleteen is actually a pretty good example of that, imo.)

This probably wasn't very helpful, but I am thinking of you and I hope you feel better soon. Here is a hug if you'd like it: {}

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eryn_smiles
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Jill, I'm thinking of you and really hope you've been feeling better over the last few days and have asked the people who care for you for the support that you deserve. In just the time you've been posting here, you've done so well in starting to feel good about your sexuality and to own it and I'm sure that will continue, even though there are bad days sometimes. Anyway, do take care of yourself and I offer you some hugs from across the world as well!

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"Caring for myself is not self-indulgence, it is self-preservation and that is an act of political warfare."

Audre Lorde

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Jill2000Plus
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Thankyou for the hugs everyone [Smile] I'll write a longer post later.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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Jill2000Plus
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I had my exams and they stressed me out so much I didn't think I loved my boyfriend anymore, I felt oddly empty inside. I cried loads, I thought I would have to break it off and then he'd cry and feel miserable and there would be no way I could make it OK. I felt even worse because I had sex with him while I was feeling confused and I agonized afterwards about whether I had used him, all I knew at the time was that I wanted to be close to him. Then when my exams were over, as I was on the bus heading back to town from college, I instantly felt completely and utterly filled with love and happiness the second I thought of him, then I cried on the bus, because I was so relieved.

I just got back from visiting my mum's, while I was there I missed my boyfriend all the time and I got stomachaches from stress, I couldn't stop feeling bad all the time because I couldn't get it together enough to help much around the house, I was having so many intrusive thoughts and sometimes it seemed like my brain didn't work right, like it wouldn't let me think logically and kept trying to make me push things down in my head instead of working through them logically and objectively. I did do some enjoyable/good stuff while I was there, I read Alice's Adventures in Wonderland, I watched a bunch of movies on VHS that I got from charity shops really cheap (I got nine tapes for £2), I plan to buy the DVDs of the ones I liked, I only bought them on tape because it's cheaper than renting or in the case of some Disney movies, you can't get them on DVD at the moment. I also bought a few DVDs and books and a CD.

Since I got back, I haven't taken a shower, haven't cleaned my teeth and haven't tidied my very messy room, I know I need to get back into a routine, but it's hard.

I've been thinking about my experiences with feminism and trying to remember that just because some individuals who claim to be feminists actually are sexuality hating douchebags who think all porn, all sexual fantasies and masturbation (particularly male) are wrong (and I refuse to take back this statement because I have met these people on feminist websites and blogs on the internet), or make small penis jokes, or don't care if you're so depressed you want to kill yourself or you are physically disabled in a way that prevents you from being able to do any/certain types of housework, you are damn well going to work hard and not f*** with the communist revolution (again, all things I heard from self proclaimed feminists, the effect of the time I spent on some of the forums I used to visit was to make me feel deeply ashamed and worthless and afraid there was something deeply wrong with me because I wanted to see naked people, that seeing any porn, no matter how pro-woman and otherwise unprejudiced it was, would lead me to become broken and develop a pathological hatred of women AND GUESS WHAT IT ISN'T TRUE)... in spite of all that, I'm well aware that most feminists don't behave or speak in that manner. I know that it's an important movement, and I want to support it. Sometimes, though, the bad experiences that I had on I Blame the Patriarchy, make me start to shake and cry, sometimes I almost feel afraid to use the word feminist, because I think of those feelings of shame and guilt and how I still think I'm bad and dirty and responsible for women's oppression, and even feel bad because I think I look somewhat masculine and then think I'm not really a woman I'm just a man disguised as one, which of course ties in with the transphobia I sometimes encountered...

And yeah, it's all really complicated for me. I am not trying to say that the feminist movement is bad, I'm just a bit stuck on the word itself because of the bad experiences I had, even though I'm aware that most feminists don't espouse those views. I was miserable this evening because I started reading the IMDb message boards for Heavy Metal and there was an anti feminist woman referring to all feminists as castrated shrieking harpies and mocking no means no rallies and men who think some movies are sexist because the women in them are only there to be T & A (and actually any man who says anything that could be construed as feminist, saying they were just doing it to get attention. And they LOLed at some stupid joke from the movie making fun of women who use vibrators.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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mma
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Oh, I'm so sorry you're feeling stuck in this place right now. You are an excellent, thoughtful, and capable person and you don't deserve to be going through all this angst for just being who you are.

I know a lot about what you are going through. You feel like you don't fit in here, you feel like you don't fit in there. There must be something wrong with you, right? Of course not. Those buttheads just don't get to dictate what it means to be a "real woman" or a "real feminist" or whatever! YOU get to decide who you are, and I INTENSELY admire that you have the self-possession to even feel cognitive dissonance instead of just going with the flow whereever you are just to fit in. It's taken me a lot of years of therapy to get there myself.

You know one thing I've learned from my therapist? I didn't have good parents at all when I was a kid, so I had to be my own parent. And, being a kid, I wasn't very capable at it, and there's no reason I should have been expected to. So I'm broken in some ways, and I'm working on it. (I feel like an awesome work in progress right now as I type this-- I wish the same feeling for you!) And now that I'm more experienced, I am much better prepared to be a capable parent to myself.

My therapist taught me that since my parents didn't keep me safe when I was younger, I am having to learn how to keep myself safe now. Part of that is protecting myself from things that I know are unhealthy for me and damaging to my psyche. It is very easy for me to get sucked in to reading message boards or reading about controversial topics. The crappy thing about the Internet is any old troll can get on there and say disgusting and hurtful things that are NOT true, without repercussion and they just leave a path of vulnerable hurt people in their wake.

I'm not perfect at it, and sometimes I let myself keep "picking at the scab until it starts to bleed" and then I get upset because of what some idiot says on teh Intarweb. I let it spiral and let my thoughts get away with me and my life becomes miserable-- as does that of my poor husband's and he doesn't deserve to be saddled with that. But if I do notice that something's straying into territory that's going to upset me and make me feel bad about myself (e.g., a feminist message board that tells me my feminism isn't good enough, anything regarding Heavy Metal would certainly upset me), sometimes I can force myself to get up and take a short walk or something just to "break the feedback loop" that's feeding the negative spiral. Sometimes just taking a break to go to the toilet is enough. I just have to break the pattern of behavior for long enough for my rational mind to regain control of my actions and then I go do something productive or enjoyable.

Sorry to go on and on... It's just that I see you as a terrific role model, and whereas I know that even the strongest among us have our vulnerable times and that's OK, I would be sad if you didn't hang in there and keep coming back here with that fighting spirit! I wish you peaceful thoughts and a joyful day. [Smile]

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Jill2000Plus
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Thankyou for your response, I find it very hard to accept it when someone says something good about me, because I find it hard to believe due to my low self esteem, and sometimes when I'm feeling like this I'm terrified that if I tell someone about it, whether face to face, on the phone, in a letter, or through sending text from machine to machine (emails, texts, message board posts, blog posts either on my own or someone else's blog), they will think that I am just fishing for compliments. I would just like to clarify that I was on the message board on the IMDb for the animated movie Heavy Metal (which I just ordered on DVD because I love animation and I like american pulp art and comics and there are very few films which fully animate that... if only Ralph Bakshi's films weren't so full of questionable racial portrayals and equations of technology and war, I'd have a treasure trove to raid), not a message board about music within the heavy metal genre, in case anyone found that confusing.

I was also panicking last night because I thought I was falling out of love with my boyfriend again, but it's come back, I think I managed to work through what I was feeling. My boyfriend's family hasn't got much money at the moment and they might have to move out of the place they are currently renting, I wish I could do something to help, but because of the state of the shared house I live in, the staff have hired a cleaner which the residents have to pay for, so I have £44 less a month to live on, I think I'll have to put off starting a savings account, or at least put less into it than I was previously planning to, because I want to help pay for the cost of him coming over until his situation improves. I miss him terribly at the moment, he's so loving and I want to be close to him (plus he does a very sexy eyebrow raise, and we don't have a picture phone). At least we've arranged to have a phone call this evening.

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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mma
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I know what you mean about finding it hard to accept when someone says something good about you. I didn't think you were fishing for compliments; it was my honest and simple reaction to you giving a simple description of yourself as you honestly are. :-)

Another thing I've learned in therapy is how to just sit with uncomfortable feelings. So I can have people say good things about me, feel uncomfortable, know that feeling isn't going to kill me, and just be with it. I don't have to do anything like negate the compliment so that the uncomfortable feeling will go away. One terrific side effect of that is eventually you stop feeling uncomfortable about getting a compliment. A shy smile and a "thank you very much indeed!" and I'm back about my life! :-D

You also sound like you're feeling very responsible for what's going on with your boyfriend's family's finances. Is taking on responsibility for everyone else's burdens a theme in your life? I wouldn't be surprised to learn that it was. And who wouldn't feel dragged down and tired and beaten when we're taking on more than our fare share?!

Have you ever talked to a counselor about this stuff? I can't describe the liberation one feels from gaining the skill of picking something up, examining it, assessing that it is not your problem, putting it back down and walking away from it! I'm not even good at it, but those rare occasions when it happens are just grand. And did you know some people go through their WHOLE LIVES that way-- never taking on other people's burdens?! Crazy, I tells ya.

(Hey, maybe it'd be cheaper to buy picture phones than whatever the other cost of having him come visit would be? Just a thought.) Anywho, I'm glad you're getting to share a phone call with your boyfriend! :-D

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Jill2000Plus
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I don't know about the comparative cost of picture phones vs. travel and meal fares (it's about a tenner per time including train, bus and food so he doesn't run out of energy or feel drained while he's here), but I want to cuddle him, make out with him and have sex with him and that's not something doable over the phone (yes there's phone sex, but while it's not an inferior experience, it is a different one from actually touching each other), it's not like all I care about in our relationship is the bodily contact stuff, but it is important to me.

Honestly, I don't really do much work, I often don't get my chores done and I haven't volunteered at Amnesty Bookshop for months, I don't have a job either. I don't think I'd be capable of coping with a job right now though, and I'm on benefits because of my ADHD and Aspergers Syndrome. I want to contribute but I'm miserable pretty much all of the time and as I may have said before, my brain keeps on trying to shove things down inside it instead of thinking through them logically, I feel suicidal sometimes because I can't take the thought of living the rest of my life like this. I always blame myself for everything that goes wrong or tell myself that I'm evil or bad for masturbating, having sex with my boyfriend, using contraceptives, not wanting children, needing clitoral stimulation to orgasm, using a vibrator (both because of the sex part and because it uses electricity), using lube, liking some porn that I'm certain is produced by enthusiastically consenting participants, eating, drinking, watching DVDs, having an iPod that I listen to alot, wearing my headphones when I'm not listening to music. I'm also hard on myself for things which while they may not be the best possible action, are far from despicable, like sometimes forgetting to turn off electrical items when I'm not using them or not always buying fairtrade organic chocolate or buying non-free range/organic meat, dairy and eggs when I'm hungry and that's all there is that I can bear the thought of eating available to me at that time. I care about the environment, I care about workers' rights and I care about animals, but I'm depressed and distractable and forgetful and I crave chocolate whenever I'm feeling down (and some fairtrade chocolate is just full of sugar and not much cocoa) and I can't cope with cooking every evening, nor do I have the time or money to acquire everything I eat through the most ethical source if I want to have enough money and time left for everything else. I know all this, and I know none of the things in the first list are wrong at all, and I know that I'm not to blame for everything that's wrong in the world, but I can't stop blaming myself. I feel responsible for my boyfriend's financial trouble because I kept on telling him I missed him and I'm worried that coming round to see me interfered with his job by giving him less time to focus on it and might have cost him money he couldn't afford to spend. Even though I know it's not true, I still sometimes think he doesn't want to see me half as much as I want to see him and he's just doing it out of obligation.

[ 07-25-2010, 02:29 PM: Message edited by: Jill2000Plus ]

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Always knock before entering my room when I am in there alone, as I may be doing all sorts of wonderfully thrilling things that I'd rather you didn't see.

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mma
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Oh, I see! I was envisioning him living somewhere far away where he'd be flying to come visit you. Nah, what you're describing sounds quite reasonable cost-wise then. And if you want to pick up the tab sometimes, that's cool, but I wouldn't recommend that you do it all the time. You need to give others a chance to be responsible for themselves, too!

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mma
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Also? I'm just exhausted by the amount of pressure you're putting on yourself. Seriously, do you think your friends/classmates feel guilty for not wanting children or for not always buying free-range, fair-trade, organic everything? Not a chance. (And by the way, I think one of the best things you can do for the environment is to not make more people who will be demanding more resources, so really, no need to feel guilt there no matter how you look at it!) Begrudging themselves the electricity to power a vibrator to provide themselves with momentary pleasure, or angsting over needing clitoral stimulation to orgasm? Unimaginable.

These things we can do to be environmentally conscious are just opportunities to do something good, not some geas laid upon us at birth where momentarily failing to live up to perfection or the slightest deviation is an indelible mar on your conscience.

I can see why you might be feeling suicidal if you feel like you have to banish every drop of self-directed pleasure out of your life to be free of guilt. But you DON'T deserve a life devoid of pleasure! And you are the one responsible for turning the ship of your life around and steering away from those rocky shallows of guilt and self-flagellation. I implore you to get the help of a counselor to help you get to a state of mind where there are more options than suicide and an austere life of constant self-denial. That's really no life at all.

If *I* was your doctor, I'd prescribe you a loooong, relaxing shower, watching a movie while eating a fat, juicy cheeseburger and a milkshake with hot fudge, then if you wanted, an orgasm or four while snuggling in a soft cozy bed just before you drop off for a long nap! [Big Grin]

[ 07-25-2010, 04:15 PM: Message edited by: mma ]

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naplement
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hi, I do have a similar problem (being responsible for the whole world, in my mind), so I had the occasion to think it over again and again... so, can I share my conclusions?

I've decided, that probably a part of my guilt comes from personal/psychological sources, and I have to work them out, because much of the worrying has the very same flavour as was, for example, the religious worrying about my sins when I used to be religious (or other, personal stuff).

When I used to be religious, I had a vague idea, that conflating my psychological problems with religion would be disrespectful both for the spirituality itself and the psychological stuff, which needs solution and not hiding and legitimizing (even if I've been unable to actually separate them).

So I would tell you, that if your irrational worries about the guilt of feeling pleasure have the same kind of flavour as your ethical worries, then those might be infected, too, and your predisposition to think in certain patterns might be clouding your judgement.

Personally, I've explicitly told my psychologist, that, amongst other things, I want her to help me get rid of this continuous guilt - I want to be able to understand, that the universe doesn't depend on me alone... and if I choose to support causes, I want to be able to do this freely, and not just because I have been programmed in a certain way.

I remember a free dancing workshop, with idealist and worried-for-the-world participants... held by a guy, who was studying dancing, and wanted to do something uninhibited and chaotic. But you can't just tell a bunch of non-dancers to go dance crazily, so we began with a kind of (atheist/religionless) meditation/relaxation exercise. And first it was about feeling different parts of the body, thanking them for their work and sending energy (not in the esoteric way, just as a metaphor), and then he made us lie on the ground, and feel the contour of our body, then feel the size of the room we were in... feel ourselves again, then imagine the whole house... ourselvs, the street... and at the end, we had in our mind the hugeness of the world and the smallness of ourselves, and this was kind of liberating; it certainly had taken the weights off our shoulders enough to be able to dance.

so I'd say, that yes, we live in a * world, but 1. noone can fix it alone 2. so we can always say, that everybody, always "could" do more 3. so we have to find ways of doing good things while preserving our sanity - which is one of the earthly things worth saving and protecting.

hope this wasn't too offtopic. I like your posts a lot, an hope that you'll be better.

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mma
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quote:
Originally posted by naplement:
Personally, I've explicitly told my psychologist, that, amongst other things, I want her to help me get rid of this continuous guilt - I want to be able to understand, that the universe doesn't depend on me alone... and if I choose to support causes, I want to be able to do this freely

*Exactly!* That's what I meant to say before, in my "prescription." I meant to add "knowing that the earth will continue to revolve around the sun and that the sun will still rise the next morning without your express involvement." [Razz]

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naplement
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an other thing I've realized while thinking about this, that I don't judge the older generations based on these standards - I know, that my grandparents aren't personally responsible for all the fascism and communism that happened in their lifetime, and my parents aren't the "ones", who had made global warming happen... it's kind of funny, how it's obvious for me, that they had limited possibilities (and they still can be good people), yet I tend to judge myself as if _my_ possibilities were endless (so anything short of becoming Captain Planet were a failure).

of course, it's hard to speak about those things without sounding heartless, and I haven't figured them out yet, neither.

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