Wednesday, January 16, 2002
Pizza 'n' porn for cons

By CP

SASKATOON -- Hundreds of inmates at a federal prison watched a pornographic movie and feasted on pizza as part of a deal with jail guards not to create a disturbance on New Year's Eve, Corrections Canada officials say.

The pornography was broadcast over the internal TV system of the Saskatchewan Penitentiary in Prince Albert to more than 400 prisoners -- some of whom are serving time for sexual offences.

Female corrections officers were on duty during the broadcast. The prison also has a women's unit with 22 female inmates.

"It was inappropriate, we are looking into it and we will deal with it appropriately," Tim Krause, spokesman for the Correctional Service of Canada's Prairie region, said yesterday.

He said a formal investigation was under way.

A women's group was furious that inmates would be allowed to view such sexually explicit video.

Dawn McCarthy of the group Sexual Assault Services of Saskatchewan said the move could have put women in the prison at risk.

"I'm really appalled," she said.

Was this a fair deal? Were they asking for trouble or allowed some inmates to free some 'sexual tension'? Do you feel like the government isn't doing their share to protect victims of sexual assault/abuse by showing porn to sex offenders?

Thoughts, anyone?

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*~*Smurfie*~*
Scarleteen Advocate

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Munchy, the Munchkin, the Monchichi

which is not to say that i don't enjoy my rights as a citizen -- at least i am one.

So, since that debate is essentially already over, I guess I'll respond to Gumdrop Girl's post:

"i only dislike the idea because as a conservative, i'm not keen on giving jail inmates too many luxuries (i'm also not keen on robbing them of their basic human rights). as a good tax-paying, law abiding citizen, i can't say i remember the last time i got free pizza and pornography. moreover, i don't have cable television, and i have to pay to use the gym."

Hmm? You think eating pizza on a special occasion is too luxurious for an inmate? The right to exercise is too special for a convict to have? Pornography is too good for people in jail? (And btw, an "internal tv system" is very different from "cable tv") You say you're not too keen on robbing them of their basic human rights, but, umm, what exactly is your definition of basic human rights? The right to sit in a jail cell all day?

quote:

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Originally posted by Jeffrey:
Hmm? You think eating pizza on a special occasion is too luxurious for an inmate? The right to exercise is too special for a convict to have? Pornography is too good for people in jail? (And btw, an "internal tv system" is very different from "cable tv") You say you're not too keen on robbing them of their basic human rights, but, umm, what exactly is your definition of basic human rights? The right to sit in a jail cell all day?

And your pseudo argument about you having to pay for food while convicts are allowed to eat free just falls apart. First of all, it's simply not free. Rarely do you go to jail without first paying a hefty fine. There. That covers all the costs. Going to jail is really not a good financial strategy. Secondly, living in jail and living as a free citizen are completely different things and can't really be financially compared. An inmate doesn't have it better off than Bill Gates just because the inmate gets "free" pizza on special occasions. Think of it this way. In Monopoly, when you go to jail, you don't pass go. While you're sitting in jail, you're losing money while your opponents keep piling it up. While you might be financially secure just sitting tight in prison, relatively, you're rapidly losing money.

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Fines? I think that's making a big assumption there that everybody who goes to jail has enough money to pay any fines at all. Sure, your wealthy business men, your well to do drug dealers, and a few others have the cash to pay the fines...but what about everybody else? Reality check...but your tax dollars go to pay for prisons. Yes, criminals do have certain unalienable rights, just as other humans have...but there are rights they don't have. They have the right to basic things...food, water, shelter, medical aid, etc. They don't have the right to vote. But giving them things like pizza, or pornography, or access to high quality gym facilities is going over the line. They don't work, they don't contribute to society, they've committed a crime...and we're going to punish them by giving them things that thousands of people can't afford? Sorry buddy, but I don't want my tax dollars going that way.

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~KittenGoddess
Scarleteen Advocate

There's hair there for a reason!

"Never insult an alligator until after you've crossed the river." ~Oriental Proverb

What that says to me, this need to make deals to avoid riots, is that either the prison itself isn't being managed palatably in general, or the guards got lazy, or...something.

I think though why you see porn as the hot button issue here is that we can safely assume that mainstream heterosexual porn was shown, to a group of all men, and so the gender issues come into play. And as well, the issue of basically bribing a group of people with some form of sex is just a wee bit dicey as far as sexual ethics goes in general.

If any form of sex is used as a "reward for good behavior" what message is that sending, and how does sex-as-reward really influence sexual psyches in general? Those questions given, I can understand why there was some outrage, though it seems misplaced, focusing on pornography itself which is an unfortunate obsession in some women's groups, and often seems to blind some to the real issues at hand) rather than this approach to sexuality, and to "bribes" with sex.

I do have to chime in with Kitten though: your average prisoner has not paid to go to jail, and even if in his or her sentence was charged a fine, as many criminals are often indigent, it's simply not at all accurate to state that the majority, or even a sizeable portion, of prisoners have paid fines.

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Heather Corinna
Editor and Founder, Scarleteen

I'm not sure on the statistics on how many prisons offer "high quality gym facilities" but ah well.

Anyways, what basic rights you believe a criminal has, the difference between a criminal and any other human being's rights, what you even define as a criminal, etc. etc. is all completely ethical and thus there is no right or wrong answer. You can believe criminals deserve no more than to be confined in small cage, fed with sloppy gruel, and given the occasional aspirin when sick ("food, water, shelter, medical aid") for all I care, but I won't necessarily agree with you.

Well, Miz Scarlet has brought up some more interesting issues:

"I think though why you see porn as the hot button issue here is that we can safely assume that mainstream heterosexual porn was shown, to a group of all men, and so the gender issues come into play."

I don't think that really matters too much in this situation. I don't see the difference between showing a heterosexual pornographic film (pleasing, say, 90% of the inmates) and showing "Terminator 2" (pleasing also, say, 90% of the inmates.) The same goes for the pizza. I'm sure there were some people who didn't like it. No matter what you do, you can't please everyone.

"And as well, the issue of basically bribing a group of people with some form of sex is just a wee bit dicey as far as sexual ethics goes in general."

Seems fine to me. Pornography is simply "adult entertainment". I don't see the difference between promising an adult video versus promising a comedy video or an action one, for example. To me, it's just a genre.

"What that says to me, this need to make deals to avoid riots, is that either the prison itself isn't being managed palatably in general, or the guards got lazy, or...something."

I'm not sure what other alternative there would be. It's one thing to _handle_ a riot but to actually prevent one is a little tricky. The way I see it there are a few options.

A) Saturate the area with guards, hiring additional ones, etc. This would cost a lot of money thus making certain people annoyed about their tax dollars.

B) Just lock the prisoners up in their cells a little longer - skipping the event entirely. Probably the most economic approach... "Those criminals ain't worth anything anyways!"

C) Promise them pizza and a movie if they behaved. Sure the movie would cost $20 and the pizza, maybe $800. Even though that is absolutely _nothing_ in the grand scheme of the jail (even in the small scheme, for that matter...) Some people believe that pizza and a movie is too great a reward for "those worthless criminals" and complain about their micro-money (diluted throughout the taxes of millions and millions of other people) getting wasted. "Why not just let those awful people riot anyways?"

However, at the same time, I don't have a problem with them getting rewards for good behaviour- rewards that allow them something more than basic needs. After all, this can provide incentive to behave, and also, I think it's beneficial to have something to strive for. I wouldn't see pizza and a movie once a year (I'll get onto the porn issue later) as an excessive luxury. As Jeffrey pointed out, it would cost very little in the grand scheme of things.

The problem that I have with what is reported in this article is that the pizza and porn was used as a bribe, rather than as a reward. This puts the power into the hands of the prisoners who muck up, rather than the jailers. More specifically, it's the prisoners who muck up who are getting this power, which is a disadvantage to prisoners who behave as a matter of course.

quote:

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Originally posted by Jeffrey:
Well, I doubt any of us have any definitive statistics on the matter (if someone wants to scour the net for some, that would be great) but anyways, even assuming that most prisoners haven't paid a fine, you also need to account for fines paid for felonies where you don't physically go to jail.

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Now I am not too sure where you are gleaning your information from, but I should probably chime in at least on this issue.

First of all, felony crimes rarely incur fines. Misdemeanors are typically the ones where a fine is paid, and this is used in tandem with local jail time and community service hours in an attempt to rehabilitate the criminal. In felony cases, upwards of 86% (as of 1999, the latest date for which the statistics were available in my DOJ handout from last year) had no fine whatsoever. None, zero, nada. Instead, state prison (or federal, depending on whether the person committed a state or federal offense) time was just about the only thing that Article I felony suspects were handed.

So the idea that the criminals are somehow paying for their own gym facilities, bottled water, pizza and porn is ludicrous. This isn't the San Quentin Hotel we are talking about here. This is prison. This is where people go when they have committed an illegal act or several of them.

I completely agree with MizS that the prison seems to have sunk to a new low in dealing with its inmates. Rather than utilize bribes, the prison guards are responsible for maintaining the order and security of their prison. If they need additional help, so be it. But giving prisoners pizza and porn in exchange for not rioting is like having a police officer let bank robbers get away with cash if they promise not to rob a bank again. It shouldn't happen.

I've been there, I've dealt with some of these people, and the people whom I arrested were not very nice people. These aren't people you want to have a barbecue out in the backyard with. These are people who are sent to prison to bed down in concrete-lined walls and take classes twice a week on how to behave themselves and control anger, etc. Part of that anger-management course states that there are consequences when anger takes over...and those consequences should be put into motion when prisoners riot, rather than shovelling pizza and porn at them in an effort to placate the very people you are supposed to be cracking down on.

Personally, I would be far happier seeing my tax money go towards rehabilitation of criminals (whether through the prison system or counseling for non-violent offenders) than towards pizza and porn for people who are being punished.

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