posted
By the by? Can I also ask, thinking more about the big picture of all of this, if you find you generally feel afraid to be very emotionally open? Not just with your boyfriend, but in general? Or scared/nervous about really big feelings?
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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yeah, thats true. its just finding the time for it now. when i had counselling before i didnt have a job, just college, and they were happy for me to take an hour off each week to go. i have a job and go to a different college now, and they dont really accept any reason for time off. i think he can handle it, because he tells me how he feels, when hes pissed off or upset about something, not necessarily to do with me, but whatever the reason he talks about it to me. the problem with that is, i dont know how to respond. when hes upset and talking to me, i just listen, i dont know what to say and i think it hurts his feelings a bit because im not comforting him with any words. but anyway, he can talk about things. in the past i have attempted to talk to him about stuff, about things that have bothered me, and he has listened and he has stopped doing the things that i've said bother me. we have had one huge argument when i was drunk, because i had been bottling things up, and then i got drunk and it all came out in a drunken mess, and all wrong. this caused a huge row, and he didnt understand why i was upset. but then in the morning, he apologised and said that he understood what i said and why i was upset, and i said sorry and that it all came out wrong. he said he understood that and he would change, which he did. obviously im not going to talk abut serious things when im drunk anymore because that will cause arguments. and he has said before "you dont talk to me about things, and you can" so i think he wants to?
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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and yes i do, i dont talk to anyabout about my deepest thoughts and feelings, i physically cant. i had one friend who i told ALOT to, and it came close to proper feelings, but we arnt close anymore.
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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Okay: that's actually probably part of this picture, potentially a really big part. As strange as it may sound, being very emotionally shut down or closed off, especially when it's even with yourself, tends to impact sexuality and sexual response. That stuff I brought up earlier about how just having sensory nerve endings in our genitals only matters so much without our brains? Feelings are about your brain, and sexual feelings are usually big feelings. So, if we shut down a lot, stay closed off and feel afraid of big feelings and expressing them, our sexual response will often be impacted.
So, I think that this is another area where if you can really do some work and make some progress at feeling those feelings and expressing them, at not shutting down, feeling able to be more vulnerable when it's safe for you to be so, you'll see some changes around this.
I think, just FYI, it's maybe better for you if you don't get drunk at all anymore. We can talk about that more if you want, but I do think substance abuse may be an issue for you based on the things you've shared around drinking.
It sounds like you and your boyfriend may well be able to have good conversations around this, and that you may have to have a little more faith in him with this. I know it feels so scary to think about uncorking a tightly corked bottle, but here's the thing: I think if you are going to stay in this relationship, you really have to do this.
Mind, it may be that you aren't ready for this kind of relationship or doing this, so if you feel that way, that's valid, too, but that means you need to think about not being in it anymore, or being in it in a way that's not a more casual friendship, rather than a sexual or more intimate relationship.
I can't tell you which is really your best choice, but I sense you're reluctant right now to even consider the latter choice, which means the former is where you'll need to go with all of this. I think if you stay in that relationship without having these talks, being this honest, and setting the limits you need to around the right sexual pacing for you, you're just going to feel worse and worse and this relationship is going to deteriorate into something pretty awful for you both.
Also? Some of that honesty is that when someone else says something, you listen and then in your response, you try and say what you honestly feel, rather than clamming up because you're scared or don't want to say the wrong things. We can say things to people that are difficult or even painful without saying them in painful ways. Do you feel like you have an idea of how to do that? If not, I'm happy to give you some basic starting places.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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i think you're right, i know i really have to just let it all out and tell him how i really feel. i dont even like being drunk anymore, so its quite rare that i do. i think i might actually be scared of 'letting go' ? like when i get the feeling i think is unbearable, my legs shake and my body goes all tense, like as soon as he touches down there. im not going to not be in a relationship with him, i love him and i know he loves me, i cant not be intimate with him, i love cuddling and kissing him and just lying in bed naked with him. i want to be with him. and yes, im not very good at thinking on the spot how to say something in a nice way, but getting to the point, like if hes had a row with his mum and hes upset or angry, i dont know what to say. if its partly his fault but he cant see it, i have the reason why in my head but i dont say it, i dont want to sound like im having a go at him too. but basically im ging to try really hard to just open up, and after i've had the cnversation with him, i'll tell you how he responds?
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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I think it's pretty clear you feel scared of letting go emotionally. But just getting to the point where you have an awareness of that is a very big deal: that gives you places to go and work on that. So many people in that space don't have that awareness. So, yay!
One way to be in talks with people like that you've mentioned is to just ask them what they need. Like, "Do you want me to just listen? Or would you also like my feedback on this?" That way, no one has to guess and the person with the tough feelings can be able to ask for what they want and need.
For sure, that conversation with him is the next step if you're going to stay in this kind of relationship (or any close relationship with him at all, really). So, yep, feel free to come on back here after you have, or if you need a little cheerleading anytime before you do it to help you feel better about having it.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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Right, so last night i said to him "I was speaking to someone about my problem with sex, and she suggested maybe I'm not mentally ready, in a way, for sex. and that might be why i dont like it" i know thats not what i said i would say, but thats just how it came out. he said "right.." and i said "and she also suggested what might work is if i just start again" and he said "what does that mean?" and i said "well, it would mean stopping having sex" and he said "what, forever?" and laughed. and i said "no, not forever". then there was silence for a bit and i said what do you think about this? and he just said "well its up to you". which wasnt really what i was expecting. i thought maybe he would be a bit more bothered, and i dont mean like, pissed off, i mean, he didnt seem to be bothered what we do, he didnt even ask questions. we went to bed and nothing happened, i said "it does suck because i would like to do it" because i would and he said "noo, we arnt allowed" and started to cuddle me. just now we were in bed, and i tried to bring it up again, and he just said "i dont really know what to say" and that was it. nothing else was said, so i've come downstairs and come on here. so yeah.. i dunno, what do you think?
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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Well, it sounds like that was actually a pretty good start for these conversations to me! It sounds like he was receptive, wasn't defensive, and was trying to make room for what you needed and wanted.
If you want to talk more, you probably will need to bring up more of what you want to talk about. What would you like to talk more about with him around this?
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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okay just needed reassurance that his response wasnt a bad one! well i guess i just want him to understand more about how i feel, not even just around sex. he knows the basics, like the surface of things. i've just never really explained much. but i guess thats up to me to just be more open, and i'd like to think that teling him what i did was a good start? Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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I don't think so. I know for you that even getting started talking was really challenging, and you did it! Sure, the first conversation around this was probably kind of short and not all that rich, but I think you taking that step was a very big deal for you 9well done!) and it sounds like he responded really well. If his responses were short, it may just be because what you said was, too.
But I think that's okay. You talked about the elephant in the room, breaking a big silence, and from here on out, talking a little bit more and a little more deeply each time is likely to get easier for both of you.
So, maybe next time, if you want to fill him in more on how you feel, you can open by saying something like, "Thanks for accepting what I said the other day and being great about it. Getting started talking is hard for me, so I want to try doing it a little bit more. Can I try talking to you more about how I feel about all this? because I want you to know because I want to fill you in and share that with you."
In a conversation about that, you can also ask if he'd like to talk about the way he feels around sexual things: having some back-and-forth sharing can make sharing things that make us feel vulnerable a lot easier.
How do you feel about how he responded? It sounded to me like you were pleasantly surprised.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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i feel alot better that i said it yeah i will do that, i think i was a little too paranoid about how he would respond. i should have more faith in him, i know he does care about me. thankyou so much, you have really helped! if i have any other questions or problems i will be sure to ask you! (if thats ok as i have asked you ALOT already)
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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It's completely okay: I'm so glad to be able to be of help, and am happy to talk more whenever you need to.
And I'm really so delighted that initial conversation went so well and that you feel good about it. I think that's fantastic news.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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i didnt know if i was supposed to start a new thread but i thought seeing as its about the same thing i would just carry on here. me and my boyfriend havent really spoke much about it since. and we didnt have sex until this week. so we went a few weeks without doing anything at all. but then i saw him earlier this week and i just really wanted to do it, i kept looking at him and i just wanted more than a cuddle, and i was thinking about having sex all day and for a few days before too. he was obviously thinking the same because when we went to bed he was being more touchy feely, how he usually does when hes in the mood. and he also kissed me properly, like with tongues, and we never ever do that unless its going to lead to something else (which i find a bit annoying but oh well) anyway, i really wanted to do it, but when he went down there, it was worse than ever. usually, i get signs of arousal, like i get wet, and i get the tickly feeling that i dont like, but this time, NOTHING. i didnt even get wet, so it was just like, literally numb. so i just thought meh, might as well just get it done and over with now. and we started having sex, and it was really horrible. felt like nothing, hurt a little cos i wasnt wet, and to me it felt empty and meaningless and just horrid. its never felt like that before. i cried after but he didnt know. he obviously thought differently though cos the next day he mentioned it, saying something along the lines of "last night was good, all touchy and stuff" and that night we did it again, and the exact same thing happened. it sucks so bad, because i wanted to do it, i hadnt done it in a while so i was really missing it and horny i guess, and yet it was so bad? i dont get it. i feel like im never going to work. i must be ready for sex otherwise why would i want to do it so much?
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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I'm sorry to hear that you're feeling s down. As for why the sex was so bad, I have a few ideas:
It sounds to me like, while you abstained from sex for a while, you didn't really do anything to work on your situation. And just not having sex, while everything else goes on as before, isn't going to help.
One of the things that Heather suggested was that you communicate with your boyfriend more, and instead it sounds like you communicated with him less. Is there any particular reason why you didn't tell him that sex wasn't so great for you? Why you didn't talk to him about what went wrong instead of sleeping with him again?
I understand that you are feeling anxious and that you want to be able to have sex, but you are not going to achieve that by shutting yourself down even more and divorcing yourself from your body even more. Enjoying sex is about being in tune with your body, not about ignoring it.
Also, just because we WANT something doesn't mean that we are ready for it. It's perfectly possible to want something, and not be in a place yet where actually having it is a good idea.
Lastly, please do not think of yourself as broken. You're not, okay?
So why not try to get back on the road to figuring this out. You were doing really great with this a few weeks ago.
-------------------- -joey Scarleteen Volunteer
"The question is not who will let me, but who is going to stop me." -Ayn Rand Posts: 8455 | From: Cologne, Germany | Registered: Sep 2005
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i dont know how to work on the situation though. after we did it the second time, i said to him "it really sucks because i really want to do it, but then when we do, it doesnt work." and i said it really doesnt feel like much. and he just said "i dont know what to suggest" which is what he always says when i mention it. he did say before i said all that, that he tried to make me more relaxed before we did it, so it might feel better. i really feel like im ready though, i love him, he loves me, i've got the contraceptive implant so theres so risk of getting pregnant, we have been together for a year and a half, when i see him i feel like i want to express how i feel about him through sexual stuff, and all this to me says im ready? and yet my body just doesnt respond. it really really sucks. and lately to top it all off, i have been getting weird cuts on my vagina, they look like paper cuts, and sometimes they bleed. i have been to the doctors and they say its thrush, i get treated for thrush and it doesnt work. they did a swab and it all comes back normal. i hate my body and how it just malfunctions for no reason! i really do feel like im broken though. sometimes i feel like guys have it to easy, they have sex, they orgasm, they feel good. sometimes i feel bitter towards my boyfriend because of it, it just doesnt seem fair.
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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Whether or not we are ready for sex depends on a lot of different factors. Wanting to have sex is one. Taking responsibility and getting birth control is another. Having a partner you are sexually attracted to is a biggie, as well.
But another very, very important factor is feeling comfortable in your body, being in touch with your body, and being able to understand and assert your boundaries.
So to me, it sounds like you're well on your way to being ready for sex, but you're not quite all the way there yet.
And if not feeling at home in your body yet is the thing holding you back, then ignoring what your body is telling you is not a very sound way to go about it. What you want to do is pay more attention to yourself, respect yourself more, not less.
If you're not sure how to go about getting more in touch with yourself, then maybe talking to a counselor would be a good starting point. Is that something that you would be interested in?
Too, if you've got thrush, then it's no surprise that sex felt even worse than usually! Have you been back to the doctor's to let them know that the first course of treatment wasn't enough? Until that's cleared up, I recommend that you stay away from intercourse altogether, to give yourself time to heal up.
Lastly, it really isn't sound to make generalizations about male-bodied people like that. For everyone arousal, sexual response and orgasm are as much a brain thing as they are a body thing, so saying that one set of genitals automatically makes sex easier or more enjoyable is very far from the truth.
[ 01-30-2011, 10:06 AM: Message edited by: September ]
-------------------- -joey Scarleteen Volunteer
"The question is not who will let me, but who is going to stop me." -Ayn Rand Posts: 8455 | From: Cologne, Germany | Registered: Sep 2005
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i dont ignore it though. right now im talking to my mum about it, i tell her everything about it, i know what happens, i know how my body responds (or doesnt respond in this case) i know how i think, and i try and figure out the problem all the time, so i'm not ignoring it. and i saw a counsellor for over a year, it didn't help, and that always seems to be the answer for everything. counsellors dont help me, they just listen, and then repeat what you said in a different way to make you feel like they are listening. that does not help me. i talk to my mum, she listens, which is just what a counsellor does, but it doesnt help. i have been to my doctor so many times. i have had swabs, blood tests, the lot. all comes back normal. then they just fling creams and pills that dont work at you. i do know that sex is as much a brain thing for men as it is for women. but men think differently, they can seperate sex from eveything else, so sex is just sex, its just for pleasure. women find it alot harder to do that, so everything else like emotions and self esteem and all that have a part which makes the act of sex so much more complicated. thats how i see it anyway. i am so frustrated and fed up.
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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What I mean when I say that you are ignoring your body is that you've told us, in the beginning of the conversation and again just now, that you frequently have sex when you don't at all want to.
I don't mean that you are ignoring the entire issue. Obviously you are thinking about it, you are discussing it with us here, you're talking to your mother and you've also brought it up with your partner. Those are awesome first steps, but as long as you keep having sex when you're not 110% into it, not a whole lot is going to change.
I'm sorry to hear that your previous counseling experience wasn't helpful for you. But it can sometimes take a while to find a counselor who is a good fit for us, and who works with us in a way that we find constructive. So, if you feel that you'd prefer a counselor who doesn't just listen but who also actively helps you in finding solutions, then that's something you can bring up during a first appointment, and see how a counselor reacts to that. It can be a process of trial and error, but when you find a counselor that you click with, it can be tremendously helpful.
With your thrush, have you always taken the treatments as prescribed, and finished the full course? Is the doctor you've been seeing a gynecologist?
And lastly, again, it's not at all useful to make generalizations like that about whole groups of people like that. What we want out of sex and how we feel about sex is very unique, and is not tied solely to which set of genitalia we happen to have. Plenty of male-bodied people feel self-conscious, plenty of female-bodied people like to have casual sex, and so on. Those generalizations don't work, and getting bitter and making assumptions like that also isn't going to help you very much.
-------------------- -joey Scarleteen Volunteer
"The question is not who will let me, but who is going to stop me." -Ayn Rand Posts: 8455 | From: Cologne, Germany | Registered: Sep 2005
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georgiexx: the counselor you saw before, were they a sex therapist? If not, did they at least have some background in sexuality and sexuality issues?
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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no she was just a counsellor, for adolescents. when i turned 18 and a half i had to stop going. for a sex related counsellor i would have to pay, and i am a student with very little money and my parents are unemployed so I cant afford one. this is as far as i know anyway, whether the nhs has any free services i dont know
Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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I think it's certainly something worth asking about. I know a couple UK sex educators who would know. Would you like me to drop them a line and see if they know if something no-cost or very low-cost might be available?
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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You got it. I'll do that right now for you.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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Okay, heard back from one so far, and here's what he had to offer:
quote:There are 3 options which are all no cost.
Firstly if there's a Brook centre near her she could ask to see a counsellor (I think they all have a counsellor at their main centres) http://www.brook.org.uk
Second she could see someone at her nearest young people's clinic http://www.nhs.uk/servicedirectories/Pages/ServiceSearchAdditional.aspx?ServiceType=SexualHealthService If she goes to a one stop shop (offering contraceptive and sexual health services) then they may well have a Health Adviser on board (the one I work at has one for instance) who can offer specialist counselling or at least make an initial assessment about her needs. If not then they will have staff who should be sympathetic and be able to make a referral (see below).
Thirdly most GUM clinics have Health Advisers and a lot have (or have access to) psycho-sexual counsellors. She can self refer to these clinics (they mostly are walk-in services but she may be able to ring up for an appointment) or can be referred through her GP (though it sounds like she may be getting a bit pissed off with her GP).
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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thank you so much, i didnt even know about those. i dont have a brook centre near where i live but i am interested in the psycho-sexual counsellors, so im going to look into that and see. thank you for taking the time to find that out for me Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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You're so welcome. I still haven't heard back from the other person I asked, so if she has anything to add to this, I'll be sure to pop back round and add that, too.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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She said that your GP can refer you to a psychosexual therapist on the NHS. It's free but there will be a wait (weeks in some areas, months in others). She added that if your GP is not sympathetic, you ask to see someone else at the practice, and was very clear that there are psychosexual therapists on the NHS who you can see for free.
So, it sounds like what you just need to do is get a referral, and than the only issue will be waiting for that care to start, not paying for it.
-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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okay, thats great. im not too worried about waiting, just knowing i have the chance to see someone is really good! thank you once again for finding this out Posts: 158 | From: UK | Registered: Jan 2011
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-------------------- Heather Corinna, Executive Director & Founder, Scarleteen About Me Get our book! Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed citizens can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has. - Margaret Mead Posts: 63686 | From: An island near Seattle | Registered: May 2000
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just needed reassurance that his response wasnt a bad one!
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